This week the guys talk about how important it is to follow proper safety protocol to minimize risk and injury on a jobsite.

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The HUDDLE is where the flooring industry can get together and talk about everything! Lead by Paul Stuart from Go Carerra who is joined by Daniel and Jose Gonzalez from Preferred Flooring.

https://www.preferredflooringmi.com

https://www.stuartandassociates.com

just my camera welcome foreign family

coming to you every Tuesday at three o'clock welcome to the huddle

here to talk about moving your flooring career forward now how was that for

jumbling the intro

what's up guys how are you good how you guys doing doing well

joining me as always as I try to rush into this podcast sorry

is Jose and Daniel Gonzalez from preferred flooring out of Grand Rapids

Michigan we're here you're up there doing a flooring project or a construction job

and needs some Services these are your guys right there So today we're going to be talking about

the importance of safety and uh it's

kind of became a little bit bigger Topic in our in our industry uh several

news outlets or industry Publications have reached out about

writing some articles and such uh kind of safety oriented

and so I thought I would uh start this off by

uh asking you guys have you ever been visited by OSHA yes sir yes we have

I we have as well so I thought we'd share War Stories a little bit and then

um get into some of the the ways that we can maybe uh look to and

improve I know we have uh some some ways that we needed to improve so

tell me about your guys's visit what was the context and uh you don't have to name the project in fact don't name the

project we did good so I mean it was just one of

those random the most recent on one of the random business they were doing work outside on

the left and they just happened to be driving by on the way to another project not even this project so they did a

random inspection um and they came in and we didn't like everyone else who is in compliance does

we said everybody go on break I'll call you when it's time to come

back in yeah you know I wish I was joking about that but I had

no idea what to expect on that one right because it was a surprise but um we actually did pretty good uh they

came in and checked for us it was pretty simple they checked all of our cords they uh all of our connections they made

sure that that we were uh you know boots hard hat

um hi Biz uh I mean we were we were compliant

that day we were complying I would say that but but the project that we were on actually required that right so certain

projects require full PPE and um they have their own systems in place to help

make sure that everyone on site is within range of compliance for for

something like that do you guys um have your standard for safety and so you

get on a job site and the superintendent's not wearing a hard hat or whatever it's kind of relaxed uh

project in that manner do you guys still have your guys's standards or how

do you guys deal with that I think that's like

especially with hard hats and stuff it's been a big thing of mine because if I'm

wearing a hard hat and I'm kneeling down it's gonna hit the back of my neck anyways and then

done so what is the point when I'm working on my knees right when I get up yeah I'll

put it back on but there's got to be some give and take um as far as our standards we absolutely love the jobs

where they're more relaxed on everything and they can we can be more comfortable

but we have no problems you know going full PPE one of the guys just

poked in right before we started and he was like hey is this High Vis and everything today and we're like yep so

you know some of the guys we got high Bish shirts but they don't always wear them so we got

best um everyone has boots we got boxes of

safety glasses out there cut resistant gloves um hard hats

like nice Uh custom ones nice

yeah so it sounds you know we

always say show up like pull PPE if the job site is not

um you know showing any

like we still want work boots here's the non-negotiable items OSHA is going to

tell you hard hat safety glasses work boots long pants orange sleeve shirts

right that's pretty much the standard for OSHA the

art are non-negotiables is either a high Vis shirt or vest

pant long pants four inch sleeves and

um work boots that's that's what we want our guys to wear now I've caught plenty of guys in

tennis shoes when it's you know a really LAX job and it's really hard here's the the day it's

really hard to get on your guys when the superintendent and the Foreman's running around and you know tennis shoes and

stuff so it's it's it's a difficult thing the I wrote an article recently about

this that I think you know I'm going to send to the Publications but it talks about leadership the leadership and the

um if that it has to start up there uh from a safety perspective and I know as

flooring guys we enjoy the jobs and we always say you know if we got to

wear a hard hat job's not ready for us you know that's kind of been the Mantra

over the years but the truth is the way you described it Daniel is how a

lot of the even the really safety oriented unless we're on base and there's a Corps of engineer safety guy

and all this um it's it's kind of the way even our more

safety conscious projects allow us to be if we're in a room installing the floor

keep your hard hat right next to you keep your safety glasses on and and be

as as far as you can take it and keep your hard hat by you and just like you said Daniel if you get up

that hard hat goes on as soon as you stand up not as you're walking out of the room

and part of that I understand from the superintendent or a safety conscious

like a safety um you know a safety director or something

from a GC is they got to set precedence for everybody because not not the whole

a lot of times you know you finish projects off in wings or in sections or phases and you just can't have you know

one one trade walking around without hard hats that just is not set a good precedence but

um so I'll tell you about our safety one of our uh OSHA I think we've been visited

three times total in 20 years so not excessively

the last one was at a large Hospital job and we thankfully uh got through but

they almost got us on some chemicals we were using that we

didn't have MSDS sheets on denatured simple stuff though that not like your

adhesives we had all that and we actually had it in the work order and go Carrera so that worked perfect because

it had the job name and the documents were attached with the

job name and the job address the whole work so that worked perfect but we didn't have it for denatured alcohol

and we had some acetone on site just cleaning up marks and things like that

and because we didn't have the MSDS sheet thankfully I had a a a friend at

the GC firm that was like email it to me I'll print it off for you and put it in your folder in our office so that's the

thing though they want it printed out right for Visible for every everyone it just has to be accessible in in and it

has to have the job name uh and the address so like your binder a lot of

guys we used to put binders in their trucks with everything and then tell them to sort it and put a divider

two dividers that would make that section for that job

um that's we we it never went that far most the time they're looking like you

they're looking at the cords and things like that well this was such a safety conscious job that all that stuff was

easy it was just like you said it was the freaking uh

MSDS sheets that that almost got us it almost got us thankfully we got

through it but so there's a reminder that's that's a lesson for everybody if you have a chemical even goof off if

it's bigger than a the small thing if you got a pint of Goof Off you got to have a freaking MSDS sheet on site for

that right and then when we like um as an installer you don't really think

of this stuff because that's what we provide to the GCS before

we even stepped foot on site right they're that's what they're asking for they're like send us everything and then

it makes it easier on our part because if OSHA goes there they have everything

right there in the Job trailer anyways yeah so you have to have your copy

though you know that oh we have everything in the folder yeah so so so just in in

um and it always depends on who's going to the this guy was looking for something obviously like he was digging

pretty hard someone made him angry he was he was on

a mission that day and uh I was almost his victim

but we're joking around a little bit but

there are some important safety things like we want to be safety conscious as as

contractors and I I know that like in the Home Building world

there's there you know it may be lacks from a standpoint of of requirement from

the top down but there are standard things that for example

face shield or uh protective glasses if you're cutting tile or you're especially

if you're not using the wet saw if you're using a side grinder or a Makita

like the um small Makita four inch cutting wheel with the basically looks like a you know

a circular saw right um but if you're doing any of that kind of

thing or you're grinding concrete we want the guys to have proper you know face masks uh or respirators depending

on the the level using HEPA filters I know we've talked about that in the past uh hepavax and and dustless equipment as

much as possible even then you get a little bit of dust right but that's where you you have to

realize too where what OSHA's looking at in what you can grind on your hands and

knees versus what you can use a stand-up grinder for and then how many cfms your

vacuum has to be for the size of the grinder there's so much involved that people if you

don't read into it you just don't know yeah because that's part of the reason I

think to have an open discussion about it is to point out some of the pitfalls because

you know whether it's my my deal or for example like you just said what if you

don't have the right CFM on your vacuum for that stand up um grinder but it was fine for your

seven incher right or something right um so those types of deals you want to

look into most reasonable OSHA people and most

reasonable safety directors at GC firms as long as you have a good vacuum with a HEPA filter on it you're gonna they're

gonna kinda be okay with you um they but like I said you can get that

guy I mean I we we literally got very lucky we didn't get hit on that

deal and it was for acetone and denatured alcohol stuff we you buy at

Lowe's you know right that could have been something you were like oh let's go grab this real quick and it's just an afterthought well that's exactly what it

was you know the installer had it in his van wanted to clean off some marks off of his vinyl and different stuff I mean

you know um some of his pencil marks or or whatever um

and cleaning different I I don't even know all of what it was on the site for

but it came out of our one of our installers vans that you know they kept it in the van

from the either our supply closet or bought it at Lowe's or something and I

we a lot of times that's what the danger is and I just told our guys like hey if

you take something on site at least let us know and we can email the contractor uh an MSDS for it right I know it seems

ridiculous but this is why we have to do it right here this could have been a five thousand dollar fine for a freaking

28 dollar gallon of acetone you know

so there's um we haven't got got that like hit with

that every one of ours that we've been on they're just looking at um you know the chords uh We've even had

GCS that will walk around and anytime they've seen a chord that was you know

just a little Nick in it or you know one of the wires was sticking out this GC would walk around he'd unplug it and

he'd cut it yeah so you can't use it no more yeah we've had that happen and we

we kind of get ticked off uh because you know uh you can properly fix them

right but you're like well there goes that I got to get a whole new product because they never cut it like right oh

they cut it with it that much left at the from the plug and you can't do nothing about it so you got to buy a new

plug and redo the whole thing but uh and if you're using 10 gauge chords like we

do for our Grinders and stuff you get 100 foot 10 gauge cord that's a 200 cord

right so yeah I'm making sure that you inspect your your equipment before you take it

to site all your GFI stuff is all your cords are in good shape all of that kind

of thing um what do you guys think the uh number one

cause of death on job sites well

oh yeah number one cause do you guys do any high like uh tile work or anything like

that we haven't but we've worked in places where uh we had to wear a harness

anyways just because the the railing on the steps foreign

[Music] there's other things the gray area right right to wear harness

it's really hard unless you got the tie off point right and then um but but

things like like that is uh is really where we've ever come in contact or like Daniel said temporary railing or working

near an edge where the safety wheel is not complete yet even if um

there is a rail there but it's not the finished product they still wanted you harnessed off

wow yeah that's the we had uh one of our

more recent projects at a high school we were doing really large format I think it was three foot by five foot

um I think it was slim Slimline or uh slim panel uh forget

the name of it from Dao it wasn't a laminam but it was similar product and

you know we're up like 40 feet and have you heard how do you maneuver

on like well where it was a trick we had to rent two different Booms to get to be

able to get and one guy was operating one boom with just the slab and they'd

have to hand it off to the other guy to get it to get it up there

it was a feast it'd be behind you too yeah if everything behind you and sliding back and forth and

well the heart they were harnessed from the back were they okay yeah

yeah it becomes a challenge that's for sure in fact unfortunately I've been on a few

projects where you've witnessed a fall and it's it's never

it doesn't take much that's one thing people that I I have witnessed a

electrician fall off of a six foot ladder and it was it was not a pretty sight that's the boss and he was not on

the top or anything like maybe two two steps down so maybe his feet were four foot off the ground or so

and that which doesn't even require you to be tied off until six feet but uh

that was a nasty fall from four foot so like there's reasons for this stuff some

of it's a pain in the ass frankly but um the more safety conscious you are as

a company here's what I found for and and I would I would say this to

all flooring contractors be overly safety so that when your guys

so your guys are more aware like if you're safety training uh one of our

guys just finished another one of our guys I should say just finished from he had 10 hour and he just got his 30 hour

and you know we feel like it just keeps them aware

that doesn't mean they are the the guy with the hard hat vest and the whole works even on jobs that are like a Main

Street office that is a one-day job and the superintendent's running around in shorts you know but they're still that's

why I say well our non-negotiables are are a few things we still want the high Biz

and that's easy enough can you just buy shirts all of our shirts a high Vis and we have a few others that they can wear

uh it's kind of cool we actually caught one of the guys out at dinner with one of our shirts on it was like

representing um it's like bam most of our uh most of

our shirts are high Vis and all of the work shirts or Hive is so it makes that piece really simple

um and then obviously pants I don't care if it's I don't care the condition you're

not wearing shorts on our jobs like we've had certain Crews

um show up to job site with shorts and tennis shoes and we just it's not that's not even an

option so there's some non-negotiables that we should have as even as flooring guys

um like I said face shield or or glasses if you're cut tile um you know properly not throwing one of

my pet peeves is showing up on job site and they're being carpet blades or utility it's all over that essentially

especially right now when they come in a package where you can take your old blades and put it in the package as soon

as you refill your night yeah I just took one time for me and this is a lot of years ago when we were working in a

project in um here's my brother-in-law at the time um left a blade sitting on a handrail

and we were working in a a special needs facility and we went home for the day came back to in

the morning to a very upset um staff there that one of uh one of the

the young kids there had grabbed it and it looked like a stick of like a piece of gum because the square shape but his

mom to try to chew it up oh man nothing happened what

just like that that one right there like I was not a like I was uh put him in a

like if I had a gatorade bottle or something I was always like one of those guys but I was like oh I'll start a pile right

here on this window ledge and I'll pick him up after I'm done if I didn't have everything but after that it was like back in the night

um after I started wearing a Polish bag and right in my pouch or there's a place like or right directly in the trash can

but then you have to tell your guys watch your hand don't stick your hands in there it's way easier just to package them up and you're saying but put them

back in the package or take it you can find duct tape when you need it uh there you go the

coffee can I remember we had coffee cans back in the day I mean like there's ways to do it just find the best method that

you want and keep your blades cleaned up because that's probably you know Cuts in

our Industries one of the biggest um and then not just like you put them in

your pouch and you're reach in your pouch or whatever right so like just properly handling those but I'll tell

you my biggest um and this was before right before I started my company I was working for

another company and the one of the guys on the job site had a really bad habit

of sticking his his uh orange razor scraper in his back pocket

he spent a day in the hospital at the ER good brand new blade right right across

the wrist you put it with the blade up yep oh my God he didn't stick the blade down in his pocket it just cut his rear

end um you know or cut through his pocket or something no it was always blade up and

he just reach back and grab it well I forgot it you know problem with doing stuff like that is you get used to it he

got used to it being back there and forgot it was there and went to go grab some thought he had something else went

to go grab and it just bam he ended up uh I think he ended up out

of work for about four weeks that's bad yeah

so like be careful with razor scrapers

um you know some of the safety like guidelines if you if you've got been

through OSHA's training or any real safety training awareness is probably your best friend

in safety in my opinion like a lot can be uh avoided if you're on a big job

site we got a really big job site with cranes and they're moving uh

crap around all the time I was there a week ago looking at the substrate

like this this is something so we're gonna have to bring in a pump truck uh on a side note to pump like 70 000 foot

of uh at least half inch probably on average there's an inch

where literally inch and a quarter waves in this floor all the way through these units and it

gets lvt but um you know they were taking a porta John

over and I was like I also didn't want Pooh to get on me but I let that thing

go first you know just just be aware of your surroundings is is um you know it

would have saved the guy from cutting his wrist he just wasn't aware first off shouldn't be doing that in the first

place that's kind of a you know I'll just say that's a stupid thing to do but at the same time

I was stupid like that I used to put my before I carried a pouch no lie I put it on my blades in my back pocket and I

remember I did that out of my butt cheek and then I remember my utility line falling through the hole that it cut in

the back pocket and stabbed me in my cab as I was walking on the way like I felt it and I like moved real quick and then

something bit me a little bit but yeah oh man

um just and you know you thought you think that that would change someone's mind but that didn't right it just made

me start getting used to using my other pocket yeah like oh my pants are all bad on that side let me use my other pocket

um well so do you guys um do you guys have like yours what what do

you guys do for your safety do you do safety trainings we we do toolbox you know as job box cars and if

you have enough jobs it it works you don't have to do something special but if you guys do toolbox talks and all

that kind of thing yeah well we might be a little a little we might be slacking slightly because we've kind of uh the

crews kind of dwindle a little bit and and it's been project the project and kind of leaned on the uh

the leadership on site to go over all of that um and we are fortunate that we're working on a lot of repeat jobs with a

lot of repeat customers and we've already been through uh not only their safety um uh curriculum but then we go

through it ours before we go to their meeting go to their meeting and then they add to it

um so you know what maybe we better just retouch on some of that too because uh you get complacent yeah every once in a

while yeah particularly if there's a new guy I know that the our field superintendents uh will

do a toolbox talk in the middle of the week if we haven't had one for a job in a while or if there's a crew that hadn't

been on a job that has them where do you guys get your safety uh your toolbox talks Works work comp company

there you go if you don't know that uh any installer if you have an insurance

company they'll give you especially if you you should have work comp so

you will get they'll provide you with a whole host like hundreds and hundreds of

of different topics and just print them off and go over the topic and get it

signed and there you go they'll even help you with uh your own custom uh employee safety handbook safety handbook

[Music] and most of the literature is already readily available so it's just a matter

of picking and choosing what you want to put in yours and consolidating information it's super simple

so I'm gonna tell you one other story that we never got in trouble for that but made it really big

and I'm not going to tell you anything else except for the story but we had two

installers one had a tick tock account and uh he was filming one of our guys

had glued himself into a corner and grabbed a hold of a door

and swung himself over to

where the glue was not you know almost getting its fingers didn't get his fingers no harm no foul but

it he this other uh installer posted it on tick tock

by the time I was made aware of it it had 1.8 million views

and people were and he had this background song of something about uh I

forget the name of the song it was like a parody of a of a really popular song but it it said something like in a world

of yeah that yeah the Willy Wonka song right there you go

so that's the song that they had played and

at 1.8 I was like this was within a week

and this wasn't modern this was

right when I mean maybe two years ago maybe Tech talk was a couple years old

at that point or a year old something like that so it wasn't like today a 1.8 million

views or 1.7 million views is is still a lot but it's not out of this world

that's pretty out of this world if you think about it back then and um anyway so we had him take it down

obviously and uh said you know guys it would have been just as

easy to leave your path out at the door glue that little bit with the rest of

the room that you had to finish anyway no need in having us you didn't have to

have a straight line you couldn't zigzag your lvt and not have to worry about it but yeah so just I might be a little

jealous that he was able to hold on the door and swing because I know that if I did the heavy fail I'd be on the field

you be in the glue yeah like

well I thought you know safety is never like the funnest conversation to have but I I thought we

could just challenge each other from asking those types of questions of what is your safety protocol you know what

what are the the what are the things that you guys want

from your cruise on site regardless of whether or not is it the same is it

pants and a foreign sleeves or is if it's really like a lacks can they wear

tank tops nope you guys kind of have are the sleeves or pants 100 uniform always

with the company logo um I mean there are instances where it's like

you know it gets cold outside they wore a short sleeve shirt or and and they're cold so they have to wear a jacket or

something like that but we we do try to provide apparel for all um

for all weather I mean we don't work outside so we don't have uh overalls or anything like that but we try to make it

so it's hard for anyone not to have something preferred flooring on the job

site right like and then all your stuff is checks all the boxes for safety anyways yes and

the the the vest and the hive is I think that's the the hardest one because like we did

notice that depending on the color by this it does retain some smell

um and I don't know why that is but it does unsure on your shirts on your shirts yes depending on the material and

the color I think uh cotton High Vis yellow and cotton

um retained more smell so I mean it it's hard to work with someone when they

smell like a bag a bag of dirty rags and it's not their fault right and I haven't

ran into that with ours the fluorescent or maybe I just stink I

don't know but uh you try to have all that in place

because you want to make sure that you're representing and you want separation right and you want if something were to happen you want to be

able to be recognizable by some of the other experience hey that's preferred flooring you know what I don't

know who that is right we're in a AC DC shirt and yeah you know it's just you

know I think well that's not only unprofessional it's also distracting and that's why they don't they don't most

safety directors don't want it on their job sites you know and and I think identifying an individual and as to what

company they are is also part of safety as well you need to be able to identify and create

separation well who do I go to if this guy gets hurt if I don't know who he works for right yeah that's part of it

so do you guys uh another so I asked you what was the number one

cause of death do you know what the number one cause for injury is

lifting you guys are like did you did you read like did you guys get my article from

Ashland or something oh really is it how it is it's lifting

so good we we do one of the biggest things and we've probably got a little lacks on

this occasionally as well but proper lifting of like sheep vinyl rolls

and stuff like that moving those things like there's an art to this there is an art

and we have some stories about that and you're absolutely right like if you don't know anything about center of

gravity and balance like there's an arch of that and many many of people that worked with us

alongside us including ourselves have avoided injury like that thing will break your leg like bam

if you're not doing it right it'll break anything yeah so we we when we do our

classes on lifting of sheet vinyl because you don't always have like you

know anything fancy on a job site to pick it up and move it around you got to get it up and on to at least on a cart

or something if you're going to move it to the far distance and one of the things we try to make sure of

is first off when you're storing it store it together tight and band it together it's much

less likely to fall don't just store one roll here and then a foot away another roll and a foot of

the way another roll if it's going to be stored there for any minute any length of time because you guys know you don't

you don't have to hit it that hard to knock it over and when it's coming down

baby you better be really strong if you think you're gonna stop from hitting the floor

I would say uh forget about strength or just learn how to move out of the way so that's the second Point actually is when

you are moving it's one guy in front one guy in back everybody else the heck out of the way and know where your points

are like if it falls that something that you're not destroying something so

um leaning it in a direction and if it gets away from you get the hell out of it yes 100 that's just let it fall and

just just know like if you guys are moving it know that drywall uh paints all that stuff is a

lot easier to repair than your body yeah if you're aware when you're moving it you can even avoid damaging other stuff

and it'll just fall out in the concrete sometimes it's unavoidable but the best thing I don't care about you know

replacing a a piece of sheetrock or a window at the end of the day if it's got

to do with someone's you know health so we do we teach proper handling of that

and then proper lifting you know I used to do a ton of VCT that's not as big of

a deal anymore but a pound or a box of ECT was 63.5 pounds and you move

30 40 000 square foot in a day you know maybe install 10 and you're

shuffling 10 and stage in 10 and I mean that's a lot of lifting so learning to

lift properly and make sure that you're using your legs and if you need a back brace we

have back braces and all this other stuff but really a technique is gonna out like there's no equipment that's

going to save you from Bad Technique No No and any any young cats out there

starting I would say take care of your body

back brace your number one don't eat it your number one tour remember your body your body yeah that's right like put on a bag I remember

unloading two truckloads of VCT and we were getting

you know getting the into the groove and then all it takes is one person oh let

me ship this box and you go to reach the other one the other guy's already letting it go out of the truck I remember him dropping on the truck

driver's fingers and that dude's finger is exploding and he goes ah and then it's like

that sounds a long time ago but that's all it took like and Jorge says that uh

you know paying attention to inflammation and and you know nerves in your in your back and stuff because even

the smallest little lifting or something can mess you up lifting and twisting

like um you know he does a lot of a lot of problematic eye and carpet that sounds pretty heavy probably rolling up

hold it in the head try to strap it on so one person can carry a big roll lift and twist is very very well and

lifting broad Loom is another you know that's probably where most because we do

so little of it anymore but man I tell you what that that's an art as well how

do you pick up a 35 foot drop on your shoulder with two guys right walking up

and let it Let It Drop right we have a video like a little short on YouTube

where we went and got a bunch of the the things that they use for appliance they

you know put it over the appliance and put it on your forearms we got a bunch of those straps and there's like eight people carrying what were they 125 foot

rolls or something into a church yeah somebody was making fun of that being

done like that but they were like just lifted up and you know what we've been there done that man and and we had to find an easy way

to do it we had to go up and down steps and through between the pews and in the

walkway like there's it had to be very controlled because of all the old woodwork that was through that facility through that church well

and how how heavy it was geez I mean 125 foot roll weighs 800 pounds probably depending on the ounce weight you know I

mean seven eight hundred pounds that's a lot of weight and you got a lot of you

know safety is really about like preserving your health long time that's how I look at it for flooring not just

an injury but long term how do you save your knees how do you

save your back how do you save your neck those those things that you that we

experience injury long term you know whatever that's called uh where the the

effects of daily use of that of your knees

you know it goes from if you start with all the safety regulations and requirements for from

from OSHA on down it really all goes back to self-preservation right like you're

preventative maintenance preventative health that's what you're trying to do you're trying to prevent

uh injury bodily harm I mean you're gonna get hurt at some point when you're in construction that's why the standards

are there because why do you have to wear a harness because someone fell at one point they don't want anyone to fall

again why do we wear knee pads because at some point someone was like my knees kind of

hurt let me invent something to so my knees don't hurt as bad I can't keep getting ready yeah you got your your job

your prod you know your trade specific items um in general you know you got hard hats

iron face protection High Vis respirators hearing protection hand protection and foot protection

the one that um to me is most abused

is hearing protection but it's not in the way well it's probably the way you think guys wearing

earbuds or earphones listening to music and calling that hearing protection and I'm like

first off those earbuds are not doing the you know they probably help

but they're causing more harm by you not being able to hear the the other people right like ear

muffs are it should be used sparingly when you're doing the work don't walk

around a job site with ear muffs on you know so you can you could take a

piece of safety equipment that's meant to my the whole point is you could take a piece of safety equipment that's meant

to help you and and protect you and turn it into a hazard if you're walking

around job site with earmuffs on and you can't hear someone yelling at you to get out of the way for something

right and and there's um some of the contractors around here too are no more headphones at all yeah like

at all not even the earbuds not especially not the big hit but like the over the air yeah like the bows the

full-on you know like noise canceling headphones I mean come on SO and that's

one thing too like it's always been a pet pee [Music]

it had like hey Daniel hey Daniel then you know that's when you know all safety out you grab your knife you throw at him

because he's not listening no I'm just playing but um so so the that part I understand like

you're right the safety you gotta hear hey watch out you know hey or somebody's backing up but then

I started using a headset for talking on the phone instead of working and having to stop

but I would only put one in that that's we're okay with like a single earbud but

we don't want you listening to music uh unless it's like and we know it's

gonna happen but we try to say like just think of yourself a lot of safety is

trying to ingrain the idea of safety it's not just doing the act because you have to do the ACT it's

I I try to approach it I know our guys try to approach it

that are really in charge of safety for us try to approach it to teach you why

you need to do this what why is it so important like if you're gonna listen to music

I mean what am I going to do walk up to every guy and like you know of they're probably listed music but

keep it at a level where you can hear other people and only one ear butt in period if you're gonna listen to if

you're going to have an Air Bud in because a lot of people do that with their phone so they don't just like you said they don't have to stop pick up the

phone they can just go hello you know um but and that's I get it but at the

same time uh we got to be somewhat safety conscious so trying to just ingrain the idea of safety and the the

whys behind each reason and then let each guy use some common sense because all this can

go out the window without common sense I mean you know

so gloves wear gloves whenever you can I like I I did appreciate all the work I

put into my counselors at one point and I took pride and shaking someone's hand and my hand feeling like an absolute

Rock I love gorilla hands yeah I loved it when they said something like that

was a compliment to my hard work when they said that but I also remember working two hours

away from Daniel by myself tearing up ceramic uh and trying to be quiet in a bank and in my hand no gloves in my hand

going through all the showers and I'm cutting I cut myself to the to the Bone and I called it

I don't know if I'm gonna finish this this is what happened and I remember it called me walking up hey uh Where's the restroom yeah this is this is when we

first started and we were both on projects by ourselves it's like

that's actually a really good point and and most tile guys know it but if you're

just demo and tile and maybe you're not a tile guy that's ever been cut down uh I've certainly been cut by porcelain

tile that's broken and it wasn't my first time it's a razor sharp

razor sharp so if you're uh if you are a

um you know entry-level Apprentice or new guy doing some demo on tile uh wear

gloves and still be careful right and that's why we got you know I always buy

them when they go on sale I'll buy a bunch of them and we just have a toad out there we got cut resistant gloves we

have work glove we have uh insulated gloves for in the winter time when we're loading and unloading

yeah and cut resistant gloves has come a long way from the first time I ever put one on until now

um they've come a long way we we like to give them to like the

the brand brand new people like here goes your gloves because it's just

changing a scraper blade we that's where I got a car right here from just going like this and then it slips and then

boom that's all yeah there there's a lot of silliness that happens I you know

um I was cleaning up just a patching trial once oh

and I'd used it all day and my dumbass oh it hurts so bad and it gives me the

cringy I bet you that wasn't the only time you've done it either no don't help

me out but no it wasn't the crazy part is the first time is always the worst and the second time it's not as bad but

you're like oh I should have known the third time you're like I'm dumb if it gets it good enough you're like that's

the last time I'm doing that that was the last time because I cut the tar out of my thumb just trying to pull

chunks of Pat you know just get the thick patch off so I could wash it and man

with the water and the metal it's used rags in a water bucket to clean our

trowels until like cut after cut it's like all right dude something's got then we got the the brushes with the long

hair yeah the brushes and that's best way yeah it is it is that's that's

we don't show anyone else how to clean it besides like that so in challenging ourselves would you

guys say you have a culture of safety

I would say that I don't want to say culture right because that means that it's all

encompassing that means that we Embrace every aspect of it 100 of the time but I would say that we make sure that we

are implementing safety all the time like yeah I I say we're cognizant not culture

yeah yeah there you go there you go it's like the culture is is definitely

is that because we're flooring guys I think it is to be honest with you because I feel like uh I take uh uh you

know a leadership kind of stance on a lot of this stuff but as safety

conscious as I am and I use the word conscious because that's what I feel like our company is but to have it as

part of our culture um I feel like we'd have to take more steps

and more steps in the direction of of teeth

of enforcement probably um enforcement's important though

because the the one thing I didn't say is the guy that had the scraper in the

back of his pocket uh our foreman

other people he was a mechanic there was a form uh uh project format on this

project as a big high school um we made fun of them like

joked about it like yeah you're gonna cut your you know you can cut your arm off someday or

watch out you're gonna shave your back stuff like that yeah and but never said it take the freaking

scraper out of your pocket right like I was only 22 so I'm not trying to give

myself an excuse but I was a little bit fearful so I would say one part of the

culture should be nobody should be fired for filing a safety concern about

somebody else no matter who that is that's it right there a safety concern right like it's not a complaint it's a

concern it is is out of concern for someone else's safety your safety that's

that's a really good way to put it um and if someone's being unsafe on a job site

I want people to feel comfortable enough to say something without the fear of being fired or some

level of retaliation well that that's where you know that's why we say we're a team right we're not it's not I'm gonna

go snitch on you because you're doing this it's hey we're going to talk about this because this needs to be fixed right like this

this isn't safe how can we fix it and it's not like I'm calling you out because you were doing this wrong it's

hey we've always maybe we've always done it this way I don't like the way it's happening what

can we do to change it yeah if you can if you can and Empower them to have some

self-governance meaning the 22 year old brand new kid that just got out of you

know a 10-week course or something and a portion of that was safety and then he goes to your job and a mechanic's doing

something unsafe or you know a full-fledged journeyman or something it's doing something unsafe you want

that new guy to have the the the uh Power to say something to him

without him getting retaliated against that's a that's the trickiest thing with safety I think because

what old dude's gonna listen to this new cat right they always get this attitude

we've watched it happen and I'm like hey man he either cares about his own safety or he cares about yours and either way

it's a it's he should say something no he's just a pompous little that's

what I got back let's see it over and over again right and the biggest one um

lately for me has been the silica standard because you got all these guys out I

breathe asbestos for years and I'm fine you guys can get you know silica is nothing and it's like that's not the

point it's we know that it causes health issues let's do everything we can to keep

everyone healthy and it's not just it's not just you know everyone else it's yourself included like

and if you don't care about yourself at least start caring about others other people yeah

like if someone has an underlying issue that they don't even know about yet and you're kicking up all that dust and

makes you know that they have a reaction to to the silica or something that's

Airborne like if they have a reaction inside we don't know what's going to happen

like we don't know that I don't know if someone like I just met a uh my son's a

baseball coach we made some food we brought it to one of the games and had onions and he said

does it have onions and I'm like well yeah this is guac yeah it's got onions in there he's like well I'm allergic I'm

like like I wouldn't I wouldn't I've never met anybody other onion so I don't think of it right in the peanut butter thing

but it's the same thing someone might have just a bad reaction uh to to something that's in the the Airborne

contaminants well and the the other thing is

um as part of the why like you know if asbestos was heavier it

wouldn't be near as dangerous but you know a particle of his best this takes like 24 hours to fall six feet in Dead Space

so it stays right around this face right so once it kicks up

for an hour before it even Falls to your chin you know like

it takes an hour for it to fall this far basically right silica isn't is heavier so and it's a

different uh shape of a particle so it falls faster but not that's a problem with silica too is it's

it's still very light and it it falls very slowly that's part of the danger it's there's

plenty of things in this world that'll give you cancer and cause you problems but they're away from you you know part

of the problem is how slow these particles fall so the point being here is if you kick up dust

if you kick up asbestos which if you're messing with asbestos then you need to

be licensed to mess with it but point is is with the silica is you're

caught you can cause people harm that you when you think they're not in harm you know you got that's why the why to

me is so important them understanding why why we use this HEPA equipment you

know it's not just concrete dust it's like you gotta understand what this stuff does and then

you can kind of get your head wrapped around why it's so important that hey maybe we should protect ourselves a

little bit better hey another another added bonus to the whole silica thing is that it made made us realize

how much how many times we were cleaning the same dust storm right so now that

you have to be more careful at cleaning up I the residual that's left over is a

lot less and you're a lot less likely to clean up again the next day you know you create a dust arm you clean up you're

like we're all good for tomorrow come in Start Spreading glue you come the next day you go like this and it's like yeah

like it's crazy yeah my very first day on the on any job site I got kicked off

I think I may have told you guys this story but I got some good old-fashioned flooring hazing going on you know go

grab the tile stretcher kind of and it was instead of that though they gave

me a broom and sent me into the sanctuary of a church that had all this wood these wood beams oh

and they were all finished and and perfectly clean all that was left was to lay the carpet

and the the guy sent me in and said hey go go sweep that room well the kitchen room yeah like I'd never even I mean

outside of sweeping a garage floor or something I had never right I didn't know the process of how to keep the dust

down let alone I shouldn't have been sweeping that floor anyway I should have vacuumed it but they are like go sweep

that floor I went in there and I'm just like

I sucked enough silica that day for all of us my nose had it my I had it in my ears I

had eye boogers that were like crusty black you know Brown I mean I was

coughing the crap up um and I got kicked off the job site because super antenna come in there and

called me the dumbest MF where he's ever met through me off the job site first time

somebody told me to grab a sweeping compound it's the same thing like go and grab the the vinyl or the whatever the

base stretcher sweeping combo why am I gonna throw stuff on the floor to sweep it back up that sounds so stupid it's

not one dusted the place out they're like Dude Where's the sleeping cup I'm like what are you talking I'm not falling for that they're like no

seriously it's it's a real thing I'm like oh oh you

guys gotta stop playing jokes on everybody like I didn't know that's the one they didn't I mean that you know

the uh all oil-based sweeping compound not to get off the safety subject but

don't use that no no use the wax stuff but the the

you know I don't I know we're not I feel like we're pretty good because we

get a lot of like just hit uh stop streaming I gotta take off I gotta get my son to his game

so good luck just hit stop streaming when you're done see ya see you Daniel

um so I feel I think we're pretty good and you know we show up on site with we

always say just show up as if you're going to uh fully PPE job and then if

the superintendent is dressed a certain way match match your Foreman or the the

project superintendent right um but I think you know we gotta look past

just what is enforced and encourage them to look

around if there's overhead work please wear your hard hat even if superintendent's not it's just not worth

it one elbow off of a fire sprinkler you know weighs three pounds falling from 30

feet I'll at least knock you out if not you

know and give you a heck of a good gash like think of your people um and I I know how much flooring guys

hate this subject too so I mean but it's so important uh there's that it is

necessary it is necessary and and protecting yourself from long-term harm but also

that short-term harm and so that's why I feel like we do pretty good but from a

overall like construction standpoint I think just flooring in general is a

little bit behind you know well we're way behind we're not just a little bit we're way behind and that's only

we most of the flooring installers are individual sole Proprietors right uh

subcontractors Independents Independence they don't they don't think about uh uh

having to maintain a program that will that could facilitate 10 20 30 40 people

and that's what it is once you start getting into that and you have to start worrying about more than just yourself

that's where a lot of that comes into place and um you know larger companies like share

your information with your um with your with your subcontractor do it with your subs it's one of the trainings you can

do and not getting any trouble from like employee employer training type stuff

crossing any lines there safety trains the one you can do with your with like

that's why GCS can do it with us right they don't send us to learn how to lay sheet vinyl nor could they even if they

wanted to right but they can do safety trainings with us so safety training is

one of those things you can do with your subs you can do with your you you should be doing it with everybody as much as

you can that's where I think the toolbox talks and if you have some safety conscious projects it comes in real

Handy to you know have some consistency in those in those meetings

um so what do you guys uh just to close this out is there anything that we've

talked about that kind of made you say um we need to get a little bit better at that

yeah I think it's just more or less uh being more consistent with the conversation and making sure that that

we're uh um stirring up the dust again the dust the safety talk right like

uh I I know like it's always fresh in my mind and whenever I'm showing somebody

something or we're talking about it I always bring it up but as far as going over specifics and being more consistent

on it like a on a schedule with it and say hey guys this is you know this is

Safety Week of you know every month or hey this is every

every other Wednesday should have a safety day you know what I mean just just so that way it's fresh and then

that's a good idea like do once a month or once a a week just like a

safety refresher even right like who who's who's not being safe who is being

safe who's making sure that it's uh implemented who's making sure that you have what you need when you're

forgetting to be saved right like and I think it's really important because as we I'm going to close out

with this because we are I can't believe how fast time goes sometimes but uh

if if everybody's successful in getting more new blood into the industry those

guys have to act in a safe manner they're going to hurt themselves or somebody else so your your supervisors

and your your the best thing you can do is make sure that everybody takes a

leadership role in safety be conscious and understand that just because the

superintendent's not wearing a hard hat look around you assess the situation put one on if you

if you feel like it's the best thing to have one on even even if it's not you're

not going to get in trouble for not having it um you know a lot of the electricians

and plumbers and the bigger trades um you know they wear it all the time dude

like it's just part of their work gear and I get it flooring you know certain

word a lot further down the road on a project so that's part of our reluctancy

I think and then the fact is is we're on our knees all day and having a hard hat on kind of sucks and so does safety

glasses they're always sliding down and getting in her way um they have what they call them bump

caps is that what they call them they're a little bit smaller um made for not in in the beginning stages of a

project but we'll get one that fits for you and and I've had the big gaudy ones and I've had the smaller ones and I tell

you what from from being a finisher going in there in a project the smaller ones are more up my alley anyway I'm not

bumping my head I'm under I bump my head a lot of things um

yeah they got they got them the size of like almost the size of bike helmets that are really tight in your head so

yeah comfortable um they even have the ones we had to buy

them for one project that required chin straps oh really oh wow

so I mean of course our old guys are like that's

fine unless something hits it and takes it off and then I'm you know it's choking me to death or rip my freaking

hell head off I'm like okay you kind of gotta can you just take your carpet knife out and you cut the strap right

okay let's not say don't listen to me guys I'm sorry rewind strike that yeah edit that

all right my man well we've come to the end here I want to thank you guys again for for being on and and as always uh

bringing some good content if you're watching this on YouTube please like subscribe

um we do this every Tuesday we don't have sponsors we don't have any of that we just come to you with some industry

knowledge a lot of years I've ins I installed right out of high school basically these guys been installing a

long time so we got a lot of uh experience and uh you know a few OSHA

visits under our belts so you know we um we hope you take this serious even

though we know it's a subject that isn't um you know the the probably funnest to

talk about nor the the the one that people that flooring guys like uh I was

eating lunch earlier and three hardwood guys walked in literally with tennis shoes and and and shorts on

and I was like I'm gonna be talking about that this afternoon and all jokes aside I know I have a lot of jokes when

it comes to safety and all that but it it's um it's one of those things you make a joke and it resonates with someone because they'll remember the

joke and then they'll relate it to the conversation but

when you're the one helping everyone learn the safety and every time you teach someone something about safety in

the flooring industry and you have a story about how dumb you were at one point and didn't follow it that's not

good guys like I know that I'm one of those guys that's not good to have this this is why this is in the book you know

this is yeah it's a serious matter and and one we should try as an industry to

take a step forward on um overall just representing as

construction one of the things we gripe about in flooring is not being uh respected as much as we used to be when

we walk on job sites or as much as some other trades sometimes or this is another way like show you're

serious about your your your safety and the safety of others and show that you're concerned about safety overall

and that you have a some level of a safety program some

um if you work for a shop and you're an installer talk to them maybe they'll put

on a safety seminar um I know we certainly do and and um

just not as often as we should so that's where I think we can get better as well so

all right my brother it's great seeing you again loved it appreciate everything

and we will see you next week all right man have a good one all right see you man

thank you