The Huddle - Episode 85 - The Role of Apprenticeships in Flooring

This week the guys are joined by Carlos Mongalo from the NFCAP to discuss what role apprenticeships used to play in the flooring industry, what role they play now, and how they affect the employee to subcontractor ratio.

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The Huddle was created by Paul Stuart of Stuart & Associates and Go Carrera, alongside Jose and Daniel Gonzalez from Preferred Flooring. Aimed at helping you maintain forward progress in your flooring career, they cover topics from personal and business growth, to installation tips & tricks and everything in-between.

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GET TRAINED! Find a list of training dates here: https://gocarrera.com/resources/training/
https://www.preferredflooringmi.com
https://www.stuartandassociates.com

what's up huddle crew it is so cool back at you with another episode of the Huddle coming at

you every Tuesday 3 pm Central to discuss maintaining flooring forward progress in your flooring

careers today we got a special guest an episode that is really um near and dear

to all of our hearts uh the role of apprentice ships in flooring uh this used to be much more

prevalent in our industry back in the day we want to discuss how to um you

know maybe some methods of reigniting that in um you know the current

environment not not as many employee installers in our industry at the moment

and it's been that way for the last 15 20 years so we got Carlos with us from

nfap that's the best way nfap the best way nfap NF cap No Cap No

Cap so Carlos and with me as always is Daniel and Jose Gonzalez from preferred flooring out of Grand Rapids

Michigan yo yo I don't introduce myself very often but I'll go ahead and say I'm Paul Stewart and I'm with uh Patrick

mahes Carrera and Patrick Mahomes I'm trying to get him like perfectly in the

background so congratulations to my buddy Patrick for pulling another Super Bowl victory home to the Kansas City

Chiefs ah yeah so how's it going Carlos wonderful

I'm over here in Miami right now just just U landed this morning I'll be back in San Francisco tomorrow

night you're you're gonna be in two state two cities that we had to beat to

uh win the championship so sorry I'm going to be making these references the entire episode but we had to beat Miami

in the playoffs and we just beat San Francisco to win anybody's feelings

but that's great well I I can tell you I do wish that it would have been uh a

different uh Team going up against I I was really rooting on Detroit and um

I've got a lot of friends up where you guys are we got installers down here that are from up there in Detroit and I

was rooting for him I was rooting for him that was a great game I saw it it

was fun yeah s they came back and and beat the Lions I couldn't believe it I thought they they were losing but they

came back it was that third quarter yeah that whole second got yeah

we don't we don't talk about that anymore we just uh s we'll get it next

year we'll get iter we'll be back old news old news bro why you bringing up old

stuff well speaking of you know championships how how do we turn

installers into Champions and uh you know win them a championship from a

installation perspective like we we touted this industry we touted about how

beneficial um and rewarding it can be it's one of the things I love about it

uh not just you know from a financial standpoint uh can you do well in this

industry but there's just something about doing a a project and and standing

up and finishing a finishing a job you're the finishing touches to a lot of these uh homes and offices and hospitals

so it's something I've always gotten a lot of Pride out of when I was installing was the completion the completed product

so Carlos uh you guys at in nfap do um a

lot in this area a lot in the arena of apprenticeships uh it's a daunting task

I've talked to you several times I know it's you know not always the easiest um thing to to attack I mean how

I'm gonna open it up with a question straight to you how are you guys looking at it how does nfap and the states and H

how do people look at apprenticeships when we have such a heavy uh influence

of subcontractors which I love my Subs we got plenty there's if you want to go out and start your own installation

business you got my support I know you got these guys support but it does present a unique challenge to those

trying to work with apprenticeships does it not yeah um well it honestly there's

it's it's um it does not in the long run and and the reason why is because you

know when we're out here and we're promoting the floring industry and saying hey there's an opportunity for you to become a flooring installed or

you know we're not selling um a job we're actually selling the the opportunity of becoming your own

flooring contractor um so that's the way that we get these students into into you know

interest into our program and and coming into our industry um they go work for a flooring

contractor for about three to four years once they complete their apprenticeship hours then they get a certificate from

the Department of Labor uh oh

he'll be right back I think um I think what he's alluding to is the opportunity

to become a subcontractor but getting these uh new what I am I back you're

back did you get a up Carlos yeah man next time I won't use my phone for this

um so once they get their certificate from Department of Labor then they can transition and start their own flooring

company and you know be a 1099 so a lot of these companies that we work with

they have the vision of they have an apprenticeship program already within their company and they're already aiming

that these students that they take in are one day going to end up being subcontractors for their company once

they complete the apprenticeship program so what we're doing now is making sure that they learn the standard of the trade so by the time they already have

their own company they're actually selling quality work gotcha yeah so as I was saying when

you dropped off there for a second I think from we're kind of talking about two different perspectives on this yes

uh you you are talking about the opportunity to become your own boss and be a subcontractor eventually that um is

a very intriguing offer right it's it is a it is one of the industries you can go

out and Be Your Own Boss uh you can make a lot of uh money or you can balance

kind of have that uh freedom to balance your lifestyle but from my perspective that I'm talking about is the

complication it brings for your placement because there's so few companies particularly I mean you take a

huge swath of the company there's very there's there's a lot of companies that do not hire on even apprentices or or

installers at all I just um got back a few weeks back from a a tour down in

Dallas and I met with like you know

I think probably 12 or 13 different companies not one of them even had uh one employee installer so yeah

you know placement is what more of what I'm talking about um you know getting them with a flooring company if if

you're to do it on a large scale can be complicated I would think because a lot

of the outlets for installers who want to come into the industry the outlet is to go work for one of the subcontractors

or go work for a labor shop right I mean and so yeah how do you

guys you just make sure you're dealing with companies that that want that eventuality of them becoming a sub as

the overall goal yeah well you know the the contractors that we're working with now um they have in-house Crews so it's

already part of their business model so those those are the companies essentially that we work with to start off with for our students

I got a question for you so if um if the premise is to get them trained to get them out and get them out on

their own at what point is um at what point does someone say yes you are good

enough in this discipline to be out on your own in such a short amount of

time you think you think four years is a short amount of time depending well not for the maybe not for the trade or for

for the trade the the skill set maybe they're getting um I would say they're becoming at four

years um at least in my experience of of

hiring hundreds of installers uh I would say they're Prof becoming proficient at a particular

discipline true but getting out on their own yeah getting out on their own it

might be a little premature but I think also what we're talking about in and what we discuss a lot on this podcast is

the business Acumen that you need to really go Be Your Own Boss right there's

there there's that piece where either going to work with a subcontractor a

good one where you can learn some of that stuff uh or doing some business

courses or or some mentorship with you know guys like Jose or Daniel or myself

on what it's like and what you really need to pay atten attention to if you're a sub to not only be successful on your

installation but be successful as a business because you're a business at that point and this is Roy just made a

comment you know the main problem is how to run the business and not training the installer right because after four years

you can have some decent hand skills and not know anything at all about running a business yeah so so what we do is okay

so right now we work with Department of Labor on the side of getting these students into the program into

apprenticeship um there's another department we work with it's Department of Commerce and they have an agency

called minority development um minority business development agency they provide the training um and the resources to

basically set up a student on the business side so that's the thing is I

feel like after four years of you doing floor installation you're kind of going to know like and you're getting paid a

decent amount of of a salary working inh house you're kind of going to be like do I really want to start my own flooring

company because that you know when you're young you're ambitious you want to you know have your own business but when you start seeing what it takes to

run a company especially when you're working at a floor with a flooring uh contractor you see the other stuff that

you never would have thought of so I feel that some students might say you know what i' rather just um get promoted

within the company and and maybe into Department yeah hopefully so because

honestly there's a a pretty low percentage of floring installers that should end up being you know their own

boss I mean particularly that that young I guess not just what nfap is doing but

I'm I'm curious of your take on this after being in it not not so much just what you do which is interesting and

good and I'm glad that you uh brought that up but what's your what's your what's your guys's you know group

discussion here what what's what what are some sol solutions to properly

maintain some of the new uh applicants that companies like nfap or fcef or

these other entities are bringing into the industry to make sure that you know

the the education continues for the person and if they do want to go out on

their own what is um what is the mechanisms or or what should we be

thinking as an industry to make sure they're successful ultimately because you know having an installer come in do

a good job uh with his hands but failing as a business that that that may not be

the best uh you know end result either right so just yeah you know off the hit

not not anything uh that's necessarily nfap uh specific but what's your what's

your thoughts around you know that those kinds of things well man you know I tell you something starting a business from

zero is not easy um from experience I think uh it's it's not it's not easy so I I I

think someone has to be really resilient and have a drive and and to stick in

there and and actually want to to learn how to run a company and and find a way

how to succeed or how to Market yourself against the competition it's not easy but I know if you if you stay committed

and you work hard and you network in the long run and know you can build a fruitful company so it's not it's not

for everyone um it's not for everyone but for the ones who have that heart then yeah they can do it but if not they

can just have the skill set and work for a company that is always busy a commercial flooring company for sure is

most of the time is busy yeah what about you guys uh Daniel and Jose I mean Dave

Garden just chimed in and said you know uh you in increasing or continued

education be should be a standard for all installers I agree with that I think we should you know ever stop learning

it's not like you get to the end of the four years and you're good but education in in business as well right right so I

I think when we talk about apprenticeships um for the most part you you kind of relate it to the union

because it's Union strong right so when you talk about apprenticeships you're talking about going through that course

for the four years and then basically saying all right now you can do whatever but I mean they still train on a regular

basis as long as they're part of that Union so I think we we just need to get

to that point where um it's not necessarily frowned upon by

so many people like I already know what I'm doing I've been doing it for 20 years so I don't need training right and

we talk about this all the time but it has to be where I think that's where the

the benefit of actually having the the employee installers kind of like similar

to the Union right but a union doesn't necessarily have to employ them full-time right they can go from Union

shop to Union shop but having the employee installers kind of gives you or

at least them um like they will actually want to train

since I mean like for us we we pay the guys when they when they come in and train and it's just that's not the case

when you're on your own and that's why a lot of the guys that are you know 1099 are doing their own thing

it's like they they either have to go work today to make the amount of money

they need to or they're going to go to a training and lose a bunch of money and then be fall way behind so it's just

that I think that's the that's like the stigma but like pu hey what's up pu he

just chimes in says good morning everyone but it's uh three o'clock in

the afternoon he's still on uh he just woke Chief hangover yeah he just woke up from

the game uh but that that's the stigma but it's not true the most successful guys I

know that make the most money in the industry are the ones who are are dedicated to Education and Training them

getting training they they invest their time in the Education and Training and

that's how they view it they don't view it as spending money to go and losing money to go get trained they view it as

I'm going to invest this amount of time this amount of effort and money so that

I can you know increase my my performance increase my my standing in

the industry and you know command a bigger dollar and get better get get

better projects get more rewarding projects that pay better I mean that's

that's what I see that's the proof that's the data uh I think it's a farce

that you know somehow you you lose money by becoming more educated um if that was

the case there we wouldn't have you know any doctors or any surgeons like they go

do this stuff uh and then you get out of it and yes there's a sacrifice period

but you get out of it and you can you can command more money I mean that's

that's what I think I I see happening more than you know I I I agree with you

it's it's it's kind of like you know you go you take all these courses you take all these certifications you're getting

better at what you're doing you're becoming a professional and you you know you build a sense of pride of what you're doing it's you become a CRA it's

like a craft at the end of the day artisan and and when I've realized from the experience of doing this over the

past almost five years of you know doing the leg work and just seeing someone talk about apprenticeship like the other

day we had a a class in Austin and this individual who's been in the industry for quite some time but he just joined

the apprenticeship he was proud of to say like you know I'm in school again I'm an apprentice I'm

learning and just seeing how he felt of being a part of an apprenticeship

program and the pride that he was demonstrating it just showed that we're it's just a shift we're not just a

regular flooring installer putting floors in like there's Pride behind it it it's starting to become like a professional and you know that's the way

we promote it to the students is that's why we take them to the to the trade show like look this is our industry it's

big this is it's not just some small thing it's it's the students that we took they were blown away they had a

change of heart about our industry and so that's something that we want to keep portraying that being a flooring

installer is not like a low job it's it's something great and I think the Next Generation by the way thanks for

bringing them that was really really cool to see see you guys cruising around the trade show and joining us on the

podcast there that was that was neat yeah that that was pretty awesome I do want to apologize guys I have to take

off right now though so um I I don't want to all right man take care I'll tell you

guys what's going on later I don't want to bring down the mood got very good all right sir Kudos Daniel best luck I'm not

hey hey Daniel sorry about them lines man hey we'll get him next year we'll get him next year that's what we say

every year so um as we're continuing this

apprenticeship talk and uh I'm not sure what's going on but I hope Daniel everything's good with Daniel so we'll

we'll wish for the best there but um one of the things about apprenticeship to me is gaining you know

experience in not only what you're doing but how to operate projects uh we got a

podcast coming up about site conditions and how they can uh impact your

profitability you know learning how to properly set up projects even after

you've uh gotten through your apprenticeship um the the that's the

real benefit of being with a company or being with a you know an emplo being in an employee standpoint before you go out

and start your own thing so we we say this a lot on the podcast here is like take your time before you go out and

start your business work with a company really understand the best ways to set

up jobs and because that has a lot to do with your your uh your potential success

in the future um you know as far as the role that apprenticeships play I believe

that the if we can figure out and continue to hone in on creative ways to

deal in the digital world with apprenticeships and placements um you know that's going to

be a need here in the future the young the younger generation live on their devices and you know the the more that

we can understand meeting them where they're at and finding uh ways to connect them with uh work opportunities

and people and making sure that you know as a industry we're doing our very best

for the new incoming uh youth um and you guys do a

great job at in incap I mean you you're very uh I would say you could see it in

your eyes you're dedicated to the kids you're very happy with what you do um

what is the biggest challenges we we understand the role of apprenticeships now what's the biggest challenges how

can the industry help out in these uh you know in this apprenticeship kind of

approach man our our biggest challenge right now is placement that's it it's it's placement

like the students are there but to find placement for usar I hear you now it's it's just

placement at this current moment um we can find more contractors that are willing to you know become apprenti

sponsor and take our students that'd be great so why don't we go through real

quick what what does it take to place a student with nfap because we have uh

there's some solutions out there for placement I've talked to you about uh jumpstart which is a go careera product

that essentially puts the new students on a platform and then we connect them

to uh our our network of installers and if you're at least one hammer above

as a network installer you have access to jump start and then you can hire off a jump start jump start is not 100% live

yet but we're just finishing some stuff up that is the concept of jumpstart but

that doesn't work well with the way some of the states work and what you have to do so why don't you explain to us the

the the methods that you kind of you know have to go

through um well well one um you have to fill out an application to see you know

what what your company is offering you know the wage scales um the benefits you provide for

the employee because at the end of the day even the student has to make that decision if they want to go work at that specific company um so we present that

like the job offers to the to the students now for a company to become an apprenticeship sponsor all they have to do is sign an appendix D which is an

employe agreement and within that agreement it's it's just stating that you're going to follow the standard of

the apprenticeship guidelines which is what what are you going to train them on

um for example nwfa and ntca has these apprenticeship guidelines you're

supposed to follow and they have the books available they have the on online university they have to follow that for

the next three to four years and complete that and I mean it's it's not it's it's great to be honest with you

because you're basically training your Workforce according to the standard of the industry and it helps you build a

quality Workforce in addition to all that when you become anip sponsor um at a state St and a federal level there's

um tax credits at a county level and it when you hire our students uh we can

help sometimes it can be 100% salary reimbursement up to three to five months or or 50% depending on the county you're

in um another thing benefit is that the students they get tools up to 1,500 um we also um cover for example

they're going to do the work flooring specialist we cover that um nwfa certification cost if they going to be

um ntca tile Setter then we also cover the CTI certification cost so these

students that we bring to the table um they come with resources that you know help them succeed not only that on top

of all that we help these students transition from um jop core um you know

a lot of them will relocate to new cities that you know they don't have any family members or apartments or nothing

like that so we help them find a place um we help them get grants so they can get a down payment to a car or at least

pay one month of their of their rent to to give a little boost in life um so we help help them get stable within the

first 3 to six months once they transition out of Job Corp and start working with the local

contractor so that was gonna be one of my questions for you was uh the I don't

know how well you guys can hear me but my microphone and my I hear you I hear you hear you just fting but um that was

one of the questions I was gonna have for you too was when they're transitioning and they do want to you know basically travel and and go out of

state and maybe set root somewhere else I didn't I didn't know if there was any solid programs in place for

that yeah so so the way that it works is it doesn't matter where the student wants to go um as long as before they

even get there we we set them up with the local Workforce board to get elgible

once they're elgible then they they qualify for the local resources and along with your company as well you you

get um partner up with the work with the workforce board so it just have to do it in advance like it has to be planned out

um in due time because the government tends to work pretty slow um so you have to be on top of it um and and also as an

employer take that into consideration um that it takes time so we can do that ahead of time and and do

that smooth transition and it will work perfectly fine so it's a pretty big lift for say a

a subcontractor to qualify for the program with you uh to to then get

apprentices into their install company is that what

you're saying yeah you know I don't want to say

it's a big lift I mean I think we're doing it already it's just what it does is creates something formal for these

flooring companies that that are already busy if you're busy all the time and you want to build your Workforce I think

it's the perfect system to set in place yeah so Jorge ask who's doing

training at at nfap in San Marcos Texas uh currently we have someone that

used to work for the Union in Washington um he he retired he's he's

the instructor there he was a a flooring installer for about 30 years

cool yeah so like there's Dave Garden said you know I I pulled it up a minute

ago that the largest problem is the 1099 system um

to delve into that a bit I don't it's it's Subs paying their their employees

or the people that work for them on jobs as a 1099 and not hiring them as

employees and properly training them and getting them um you know uh in touch

with different opportunities to become better I think that's what he's referring to uh he's he may chime in and

correct me but you know uh Dave is uh used to own a large uh I think his son

runs it now but used to own a large uh labor shop so the labor shops ought to be different I if you're a head

installer you should be hiring employees or at least that's that that would be the best way to then you know help that

employee go uh you know further their education and get better um we've talked

about it here on the podcast before but I think you know

um it's not as prevalent as as I think it used to be and that's subs or

installers not wanting to train other installers because they're training them to take their jobs kind of thing I think

we know we all know that stigma it doesn't I know a lot of people that love to train uh a lot of installers that

love teaching the Next Generation Um do you run across that much Carlos in the

when you place a new uh Apprentice into a place where the feedback comes back

that he's not being well received or something to like or is that is that a far is that

a is that a old tale that just keeps coming up no actually

um uh from our experiences past three years what we realize is it depends on

the on the size of the company if it's a big company that has many in-house installers like you know the guy has a

lot of Vans and he sends sends them out to to complete his contracts like there

that it works perfectly fine with our students but when it's someone that just has doesn't even have a shop only has a

van like a subcontractor and it's I we sent students to go work with them and

it it just didn't work out for some particular reason um he didn't want to even take the time to even when we told

him to an apprentice they didn't want to train him at all I don't know what happened I'll chime in on that one right

there and I understand that that portion too because we were we were once stuck in that uh in that rut where we felt

that we didn't have the time to focus training on individuals right so it was

we have deadlines in the commercial in the commercial world we have deadlines and and we would start training and then we'd start running out of time and say

all right you know what I'm running out of time I have to have you go do this because I know you do this well um and then then the next project we'll try to

pick up and that that kind of uh that kind of derails the training and motivation a little bit both for the

employer and the employee uh because you know there's gaps in between but um I

think once we started doing more in-house and practice training um on our slower days and recognizing when it was

a good time to split the crew in half and have some guys come here in practice while the other guys are on a project um

we started doing that we started getting a little more ahead of the game for for us

anyway yeah and you guys have sent your employees to you know different trainings and and uh uh certifications

you know what I'm saying so yeah you see the value there I here at at my flooring

company um when I would say there's five or at least five if not six or seven of

our subs that used to be hourly employees here so you know we we don't

try to stop them uh we do try to have an exit interview uh with them sometimes it

does stop them and explain to them all of the requirements that are going to

you know be on their shoulders now to fulfill as a business owner and um I

think that's good a good thing for a company to do I don't want to stifle

entrepreneurship uh in many cases we ended up with one hell of a sub out of the deal and they they went on to uh

hire more people and you know more doers

and and do it the right way and and make make a great sub uh others have fallen

pretty hard and so I all I can do is continue to encourage people that if

you're going to be if you want to go out and be a subcontractor it's awesome but

please know what you're getting into and understand that this problem of hiring people it's one of the main things I see

on the Facebook pages all the time is like I can't find any good help I can't well there's resources out there nfap is

one of them but you have to be prepared you have to own a you have to treat your your installation company as a business

and then you can kind of check some of these boxes reach out to nfap reach out

to fcef start looking at ways reach out to go careera we'll get you to where you can have access to the uh jump start and

you can have access to you know young Talent or newer talent to the industry

anyway um but you got to run your business like a business and if you just go out you

get a van you get some tools and you start installing floors and you don't really treat your company like a

business uh like David said earlier he he kind of confirmed that the largest issue that he's talking about when he

said 1099 is the individual subcontractor misusing the system to avoid running a

business properly yeah that's a pretty good sum up of what I'm talking about here is uh you know you got to run it

like a business that's right and then I think uh Dwayne on there too it to answer his

question is kind of what you just alluded to is is run it like a business that's the only way to run that successful workroom is it doesn't matter

if your labor only full retail or retail and then you sub everything out you know you still have to understand the

business aspect of the industry business is business if it's it's got to be for-profit it's got to make money to

sustain itself regardless um your your people are your tools um their mindset

their health their education those are their tools you got to feed you got to feed into that right you gotta you got

to make sure that you're catering to those tools so that way they can get better they can get sharper in turn your

business will get better your business will get sharper um takes a it takes a while to

understand that you have to invest time and money into getting better and

getting everyone around you better um it's just it's hard at first when you don't feel like you're generating the

revenue um but you have to you so we're talking about when we're talking about

running it like a business we're talking about caring about your people we're talking about caring about uh your p&l

like actually make sure you're making money uh we're talking about caring about your equipment and we're talking

about you know controlling your expenses making sure that you're your profit

model or your Revenue model you know makes enough money to cover those things and pay you well and that your people

are one of your most important assets many times I think what what I'm reading in most of these you know here's the

problem kind of comments is it's when it subs hook up with someone else and they

split the the money or they hook up with someone and you're like you're going to get 10% of every job we do and I'm going

to pay you as a$ 1099 a sub you know subbing to another sub

subbing to another sub kind of scenario or 1099 1099 to 1099 that's where you

just get lost in the mix and that is a problem in our industry uh you know if

you're if you're a if you are a shop or you're a labor um you know whether some

people call them Brokers or what have you but if you if you own a labor shop

and you are working the the thing that separates you from uh everyone else is

how you treat your people and how you educate your people and how you pour into them to help them get better like

Jose was just talking about and well you know guys I want to

add something about that that whole 109 1099 thing um not too long ago I had a meeting with the company in in Dallas

Texas and he was in informing me that the IRS is starting to track down and stuff like that if a company that's

supposedly 1099 is receiving more than 80% of income from one company that

that's not even $199 and then the IRS is going to go after that company to get those taxes so that's something that's

in the right now that's a trickle up yeah that's what's happening right now in Texas so this guy's like he's like

hey I got to change my model and just do um W2s just to avoid that that wave

that's about to take out a lot of companies within our industry yeah they there's there's a lot

of different metrics that they're using uh one of them being you know uh control

one of them being um the capability for profit and

loss uh that's another metric that they you know can these sub lose money right

uh scheduling you know and that that falls falls under the control piece uh taxes

uh work comp those kinds of deals and and is the sub working for other people that's one of the reasons I'm so you

know Pro go Carrera the fact is is that all my installers that work for me are

also on the network doing work for other people and it's all right there on the platform and you can see that that uh

they don't just work for me uh they may work a lot of time for uh or I shouldn't

say for me but with me as a trade partner but they also get other work on

go Carrera and it's it's a they have to to maintain their own insurance they

have to maintain their w9s and pay their taxes and that stuff but it's really

important that we don't it's really important that we don't try to work the system like hire

good people try to pour into your people if you're a sub our hourly employees are benefited with health insurance and paid

by the hour on a W2 with a company van you know uh with free work gear and and

and and and equip and then our subs they have to they have to take care of all of their own stuff

if they're traveling they got to get their own hotel rooms uh you know those kinds of deals if our if our uh hourly

employees are traveling well what guess what they got their hotel already taken care of where it's at paid for done and

so you can run a a system where you have both employee installers and Subs but

you have to have clear definition between how you treat them and you can't can't treat a sub like an employee and I

think that's a lot of what like David and and and uh uh some of the other

comments are are referring to is the fact is is like dude you know R that's

the only way for us to increase the health of the industry and get these these new crew these new um uh

apprentices or new people coming into the to the industry to build them up and

make them better I I've said it for a long time ever since I sat into a in a

uh a uh seminar talking about the installation crisis and how big it was

and all the metrics around it I thought what a catastrophe to not only have that

shortage but if we fix and bring in the kind of numbers they're talking about how do we properly make sure that

they're placed with quality other Quality Companies and other quality installers to make sure that they

continue to get better because that's the fastest way to lose them I almost didn't end up in this industry

because I ended up with some jerk that was just a jerk to me as my my first uh

you know my first mechanic and um you know we got to change that attitude and

and and invite these guys in invite these new uh me men and women into our

industry and pour into them and try and help them get better so I I want to touch based on

another question Dwayne kind of finished it he just wanted to know he meant his question was more directed how do you

how does he get um or how does he start using the installers thatf nfap are are

providing um and I think it's just a matter he said it earlier and Dwayne must must not have been out but you just gotta fill out a form like a pre-qual

and give you some information and see where it goes from there and I don't think where's way located he's located here in wiah wiah

you know yeah so the first time the first time I was over there I say Hey where's wi at they're like What's

um but I do want to I do want to add just for clarification too just in case anybody's there's a QR code Dwayne uh

that that'll get you to to the place where you need to get in contact with

Carlos and uh hopefully that helps you out a little bit so so so some of the benefit and

this I'm going to kind of summarize it a little bit is uh nfap is providing

training for individuals to put them out there in the workforce um to introduce them to companies or to go on their own

um if you're one of the companies that are able to um I don't want to say adopt right but able to take on a few

employees you take them on you give them additional training after a few years then it's up to the individual to decide

whether they stay or become self-employed um and I guess it goes back to it's no different than somebody

getting hired off the streets except for you are giving them a head start for companies you're getting some some basic

training in some basic flooring knowledge and companies like myself wouldn't have to start from scratch on

the training portion of it um now yeah you I want to say something about that

yeah let me add on top of that um you know what we're really doing is we're vetting out the students ahead of time

um you know they they go through electrical trade they go through Plumbing they go through you know

painting all different type of Trades so by the time they get to us and and exit

our program you know you're getting someone who said hey you know I see this as a career path I see it as something I

can do you know for the rest of my life so you're getting someone who's not thinking about oh let me try it out and see if I like it no you're getting

someone who wants to grow in it and and do something and and become something great in the industry um and the other

thing is we look for individuals you know who have great character that we see that will be have a a bright future

um it's it takes a lot of our resources and time but we're doing that vetting out for the for the contract we're doing

that service for them because we want the contractors to be busy getting the next contract to keep these students

busy and making money well that's a good distinction I

mean bringing you know we all have experienced like the new guy um CFI did

a two-week course and uh we utilize that twoe

course to vet out some guys I mean if you're not going to stay at a twoe course then you're probably not going to make it here we ended up with one good

guy he's still employed with us today and um so anything that the industry

does in these regards to preet and make sure that they want to be in the flooring industry um I I think that's

you know a a huge Service uh so thank you for what you do Carlos we've already

believe it or not come up to the end of the podcast I want to once again thank you for uh joining us um everybody just

just want to say Jose's brother Daniel is fine he does have a puppy that's not

doing well and uh I don't mind saying it here at the he didn't want to bring down the mood but sounds like one of his

puppies a big dog guy and as well as Daniel is or Jose is um but his puppy's

not doing well so he had to had to go um so but thank you to to him for joining

um if you enjoy the the type of content that we bring here we encourage you to

you know come see us on Apple or Spotify you know we're on

YouTube um you know give us a thumbs up a thumbs down whatever you want to do

give us some some content um that you want us to talk about we got some really

good episodes coming up and with some really great sponsors and and really

great uh manufacturers and and just you know people trying to change the industry like yourself Carlos so thanks

again for joining us and uh again everybody thank you for the comments

really appreciate it and I appreciate all of uh you guys joining us and with

that I'm I'm gonna say break all right thanks than thanks for the congratulations to the Chiefs last thing

I gotta say it all right guys we'll see you guys next week again 3 pm Central uh

on Tuesdays thanks everyone right see you [Music]

Carlos